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14-02-2008, 02:37am
It was written before the speach,makes for a interesting read,well said in my opinion...
In light of tommorows 'history-making' apology to the 'Stolen Generation', here are a few choice opinions that sum up my feelings on the subject pretty well.
Anybody who agrees, repost it and tell everyone how you feel about it. If you disagree, feel free to quietly disapprove, or grow some balls and tell me why I, and all these people, are wrong.
'To apologise for saving people from an evil that is clearly an epidemic in Aboriginal communities to this day is itself a form of abuse, immediate and retrospective, because it deines the wrong done to them at the hands of their own people.
If good people hadn't rescued many children who are now called 'stolen' we would be being criticised for doing nothing to help them, and would have to apologise for that, too.
An apology to the Aboriginal people who were genuinely wronged would not be so problematic were it based on truth.
It should include an aplogy from Aboriginal elders to all Aboriginal children who were, or are still being, abused; an apology to those good people who ministered to the victims of abuse but whose names and good deeds have now been besmirched, as well as a "thank you" from those who were rescued.'
- David P, Warwick.
'The 'sorry' vs 'not sorry' debate rages strongly here (and the 'not sorries' are winning by light years of course) but the real debate should be the myth of the Stolen Generation. Journalist Andrew Bolt quite respectfully asked for proof of any stolen person who didn't benefit from their 'stealing' and was met by deathly silence.
It's bad enough to be expected to apologise for something you didn't do, but to apologise for something that never happened at all is beyond ridiculous.'
- Dave J, Brisbane.
'This is an apology we don't need - it's a political stunt and may lead to compensation of billions.'
- Julie.
'On May 13, 1939, a little boy was born to a 15-year-old schoolgirl in Sydney. She never had the chance to cuddle her newborn son. As was the practice at the time, he was immediately whisked away, taken to a church-run foster home and a few months later adopted by an Anglo-Celtic family in Newcastle. The young mother would have been ostracised as a fallen woman if she had insisted on keeping her baby. The motive for removing the child was well-intentioned. In fact, this boy eventually became a successful military oficer, public servant and economics consultant, author and had an outstanding academic career.
In the meantime, his birth mother (now 83), has suffered a lifetime of regret that she could never raise her child.
Now Kevin Rudd is going to apologise on behalf of the nation to both the mother for her stolen baby and to the boy for the family he has never met. And about time, too. But perhaps I misunderstand.
I am that boy - but I'm not black.
Only Aboriginal children were stolen; thousands of adopted white children, forcibly taken from their mothers, were not 'stolen'. While I can sympathise with the Stolen Generation, I will apologise to 'stolen' Aboriginal children at the same time I receive my apology from the government and society.'
- Brian A, Cashmere.
So far, I haven't bothered to attempt to get my thoughts published, so here it is for those who are interested -
Obviously, indigenous people are still having problems with abuse, alcoholism and drug abuse, neglect, education and health care that has existed since white people arrived in this country. By the way, the white people had no choice but to come here either - if you're going to blame anyboy, blame the people who were running England at the time. Blame the Queen now, or the King who was in charge back in the day.
The fact of the matter is, we're being labelled racist because we 'stole' children from neglectful, abusive homes in an attempt to give them a better life by sending them to school, clothing and feeding them at the government's expense, and helping them to achieve something in their lives. We are still doing this today. However, if the government had sat back and said, 'Nuh-uh, we can't take kids away from their mothers or there'll be hell to pay,' and not even tried to help, we'd be labelled racist for not intervening and giving the blacks a hand. We'd not only be called racist, but we'd have class actions launched against the government to pay them money, which they're demanding anyway now that Rudd has promised to acknowledge the 'wrongs' that were committed against them.
Basically, the only way I could bring myself to support this apology is to have a promise from the government that, once all is said and done, indigenous Australians will be made to stand on their own two feet and work it out themselves. No more ABSTUDY (they can apply for Austudy like the rest of us), no more extra allowances, no more jumping waiting lists for public housing over caucasians who are just as needy, no more home or car loans at lower interest rates (or, for that matter, the rule that once a loan is taken out, all you have to make is two payments and then the government will pay the rest if you don't want to or can't), no more getting Centrelink without any obligation to do WFTD or looking for work as caucasians have to do, no more adjusting school marks for those that identify as ATSI so they have an unfair advantage over white students who may struggle just as much to learn, no more subsidised school trips, fees, uniforms or textbooks, no more employer incentives to employ indigenous people over white applicants, no more handouts that caucasians aren't eligible for (and there are plenty), and no compensation.
As some have pointed out, the question has been asked - 'Was there anybody out there who truly was disadvantaged by their being taken from their mother and given an education?' And as pointed out, nobody has put their hand up. So as I've maintained for as long as I have understood the term 'Stolen Generation', no harm was done to anybody - they were given a chance and if they didn't use it and become better people, that's not my problem and definitely something I shouldn't be asked to apologise or pay for.
Like I said, until Rudd gives me as a taxpayer his word that indigenous Australians will be given EXACTLY the same rights as every other Australian, no more and no less, and denies them any compensation for something they've already been compensated for a million times over, and every day of their lives, I will not be supporting this apology in any way, shape or form.
(And I don't give a shit that they 'weren't recognised as citizens' or 'given the right to vote' until the late 1960's. They have those rights now, what the f*** more do they want? WHEN WILL THEIR GREED AND BLAMING WHITE AUSTRALIA STOP, and when will their taking responsibility for their own actions creating their sorry state of affairs start?)'
Oh, and just for the record - if anybody out there is one of 'those' who are indigenious but 'don't recieve any handouts' (because they don't 'identify as ATSI'), don't you dare open your mouth to me. If you didn't tick the boxes on your school exams, if you didn't make sure to identify as ATSI wherever possible, then you obviously have no right to be called an ATSI, and chances are you're ashamed of your culture, history and people. Therefore, you're just as good as the rest of us, so you keep your mouth closed.
In light of tommorows 'history-making' apology to the 'Stolen Generation', here are a few choice opinions that sum up my feelings on the subject pretty well.
Anybody who agrees, repost it and tell everyone how you feel about it. If you disagree, feel free to quietly disapprove, or grow some balls and tell me why I, and all these people, are wrong.
'To apologise for saving people from an evil that is clearly an epidemic in Aboriginal communities to this day is itself a form of abuse, immediate and retrospective, because it deines the wrong done to them at the hands of their own people.
If good people hadn't rescued many children who are now called 'stolen' we would be being criticised for doing nothing to help them, and would have to apologise for that, too.
An apology to the Aboriginal people who were genuinely wronged would not be so problematic were it based on truth.
It should include an aplogy from Aboriginal elders to all Aboriginal children who were, or are still being, abused; an apology to those good people who ministered to the victims of abuse but whose names and good deeds have now been besmirched, as well as a "thank you" from those who were rescued.'
- David P, Warwick.
'The 'sorry' vs 'not sorry' debate rages strongly here (and the 'not sorries' are winning by light years of course) but the real debate should be the myth of the Stolen Generation. Journalist Andrew Bolt quite respectfully asked for proof of any stolen person who didn't benefit from their 'stealing' and was met by deathly silence.
It's bad enough to be expected to apologise for something you didn't do, but to apologise for something that never happened at all is beyond ridiculous.'
- Dave J, Brisbane.
'This is an apology we don't need - it's a political stunt and may lead to compensation of billions.'
- Julie.
'On May 13, 1939, a little boy was born to a 15-year-old schoolgirl in Sydney. She never had the chance to cuddle her newborn son. As was the practice at the time, he was immediately whisked away, taken to a church-run foster home and a few months later adopted by an Anglo-Celtic family in Newcastle. The young mother would have been ostracised as a fallen woman if she had insisted on keeping her baby. The motive for removing the child was well-intentioned. In fact, this boy eventually became a successful military oficer, public servant and economics consultant, author and had an outstanding academic career.
In the meantime, his birth mother (now 83), has suffered a lifetime of regret that she could never raise her child.
Now Kevin Rudd is going to apologise on behalf of the nation to both the mother for her stolen baby and to the boy for the family he has never met. And about time, too. But perhaps I misunderstand.
I am that boy - but I'm not black.
Only Aboriginal children were stolen; thousands of adopted white children, forcibly taken from their mothers, were not 'stolen'. While I can sympathise with the Stolen Generation, I will apologise to 'stolen' Aboriginal children at the same time I receive my apology from the government and society.'
- Brian A, Cashmere.
So far, I haven't bothered to attempt to get my thoughts published, so here it is for those who are interested -
Obviously, indigenous people are still having problems with abuse, alcoholism and drug abuse, neglect, education and health care that has existed since white people arrived in this country. By the way, the white people had no choice but to come here either - if you're going to blame anyboy, blame the people who were running England at the time. Blame the Queen now, or the King who was in charge back in the day.
The fact of the matter is, we're being labelled racist because we 'stole' children from neglectful, abusive homes in an attempt to give them a better life by sending them to school, clothing and feeding them at the government's expense, and helping them to achieve something in their lives. We are still doing this today. However, if the government had sat back and said, 'Nuh-uh, we can't take kids away from their mothers or there'll be hell to pay,' and not even tried to help, we'd be labelled racist for not intervening and giving the blacks a hand. We'd not only be called racist, but we'd have class actions launched against the government to pay them money, which they're demanding anyway now that Rudd has promised to acknowledge the 'wrongs' that were committed against them.
Basically, the only way I could bring myself to support this apology is to have a promise from the government that, once all is said and done, indigenous Australians will be made to stand on their own two feet and work it out themselves. No more ABSTUDY (they can apply for Austudy like the rest of us), no more extra allowances, no more jumping waiting lists for public housing over caucasians who are just as needy, no more home or car loans at lower interest rates (or, for that matter, the rule that once a loan is taken out, all you have to make is two payments and then the government will pay the rest if you don't want to or can't), no more getting Centrelink without any obligation to do WFTD or looking for work as caucasians have to do, no more adjusting school marks for those that identify as ATSI so they have an unfair advantage over white students who may struggle just as much to learn, no more subsidised school trips, fees, uniforms or textbooks, no more employer incentives to employ indigenous people over white applicants, no more handouts that caucasians aren't eligible for (and there are plenty), and no compensation.
As some have pointed out, the question has been asked - 'Was there anybody out there who truly was disadvantaged by their being taken from their mother and given an education?' And as pointed out, nobody has put their hand up. So as I've maintained for as long as I have understood the term 'Stolen Generation', no harm was done to anybody - they were given a chance and if they didn't use it and become better people, that's not my problem and definitely something I shouldn't be asked to apologise or pay for.
Like I said, until Rudd gives me as a taxpayer his word that indigenous Australians will be given EXACTLY the same rights as every other Australian, no more and no less, and denies them any compensation for something they've already been compensated for a million times over, and every day of their lives, I will not be supporting this apology in any way, shape or form.
(And I don't give a shit that they 'weren't recognised as citizens' or 'given the right to vote' until the late 1960's. They have those rights now, what the f*** more do they want? WHEN WILL THEIR GREED AND BLAMING WHITE AUSTRALIA STOP, and when will their taking responsibility for their own actions creating their sorry state of affairs start?)'
Oh, and just for the record - if anybody out there is one of 'those' who are indigenious but 'don't recieve any handouts' (because they don't 'identify as ATSI'), don't you dare open your mouth to me. If you didn't tick the boxes on your school exams, if you didn't make sure to identify as ATSI wherever possible, then you obviously have no right to be called an ATSI, and chances are you're ashamed of your culture, history and people. Therefore, you're just as good as the rest of us, so you keep your mouth closed.