Hayabusa Gearbox - the fixed model

[fasterfaster]

If it's your clutch push rod seal .............. make sure there is no hardened chain gunk built up on push rod shaft or shaft damage as that'll do it. It is an 09 model ? Check also for excessive sprocket cover flex as thats very early failure for a push rod seal ? At $1200 the shop must be on a hill.
Aaaaaaaaaaah it's a 99 model not an 09 ?

[Madmax]

G'Day Max,

Job well done.

Just wondering what was going on with the box that prompted
you to pull it down? And what did you change to fix it? Did you get
the teeth undercut in the process? Were any of your selector forks
bent?

I've probably missed all this on earlier threads.

Cheers Bone.

Hi Bone,
she was lurching at the hiugher rev rate - around 6 to 7,000 rpm and up she would suddenly lurch out of gear and back into gear. The first time she did it I lost traction on the back tyre and left a nice black squiggle on the tar - scared the shit out of me. Then it did it again. I had an '84 FJ1100 that did the same thing but was covered by warranty, so I knew what was happening.
Goingeasily through the gear and nothing would happen, so it was only when I was getting towards maximum horsepower through the gearbox that had her doing it.

I took the clusters down to my local bike shop and had them tell me what to replace - the pictured cogs and selector fork. As you can see from the poicture, the selector fork was munted well and truly.
Pete has suggested also putting heavier quality guide rods for the selector forks, if I have to do this again I'll be using his suggestion.


Max

---

Well done and thanks for the pics. I have just decided to basically do the same job myself on my '09 after seeing them. Was not looking forward to spending upwards of 1200 bucks to replace a $4 seal but didn't have confidence enough to attempt the job .... I will try to better 30 hours though..lol. BTW. Which manual do you have ?? I have the haynes and it seems ok.

Mike, do yourself a favour mate, get rid of the Haines and get a Shop Manual if you're going to do this job. Just can't speak highly enough about the manual, and I'm nusing a Haines for my old GPZ550 rebuild - they just don't compare.
I'm going to suggest that you get a hold of 2 Warren and Brown torque wrenches. That way you'll avoid the heartache of broken or threaded bolts.
The first is in the 10 to 220in/pounds range. The easiest bolts to f*** completely are the little ones that the manual tells you to tighten to 7ftlbs. There are so many of the little turds and you only have to strip a thread or brake 1! to bugger the job and turen into a nightmare of heli-coils/ easi-outs etc.
The 2nd is in the rnage of 10 to 80 ftlbs, that's the rest of the bolts in the motor. Niether of these things cost peanuts. Remember the old saying "Pay peanuts get monkeys!"
Don't go to Repco or any of the other major motor repair tools shops. I they'll charge you over $300 for each of these suckers. However I got them for over $100 off each from Fisher Discounts here in Canberra, ring them and ask for a decent price.
Remember 1 busted or screwed thread can really cause you drama!


Good luck with the job.



Max

[Bone]

[quote='Bone' pid='225608' dateline='1284664935']
G'Day Max,

Job well done.

Just wondering what was going on with the box that prompted
you to pull it down? And what did you change to fix it? Did you get
the teeth undercut in the process? Were any of your selector forks
bent?

I've probably missed all this on earlier threads.

Cheers Bone.

Hi Bone,
she was lurching at the hiugher rev rate - around 6 to 7,000 rpm and up she would suddenly lurch out of gear and back into gear. The first time she did it I lost traction on the back tyre and left a nice black squiggle on the tar - scared the shit out of me. Then it did it again. I had an '84 FJ1100 that did the same thing but was covered by warranty, so I knew what was happening.
Goingeasily through the gear and nothing would happen, so it was only when I was getting towards maximum horsepower through the gearbox that had her doing it.

I took the clusters down to my local bike shop and had them tell me what to replace - the pictured cogs and selector fork. As you can see from the poicture, the selector fork was munted well and truly.
Pete has suggested also putting heavier quality guide rods for the selector forks, if I have to do this again I'll be using his suggestion.


Max thanks for the info!!

Was wondering if it was related to the bent shifter fork probs that
made gear selection difficult..obviously not...but the info/pics in your thread seem to show that for major g/box work the cylinder block removal and crankcase spilt don't have to be done..thank you for that.

Cheers Bone!

[Greeny_SA]

Yes Pete , I think that was the case ,We bought 6 new bolts just incase.
By the way thanks for that welded torque limiter ,Your welder is an artist, fantastic job .

[Madmax]

[quote='Bone' pid='225608' dateline='1284664935']
G'Day Max,

Job well done.

Just wondering what was going on with the box that prompted
you to pull it down? And what did you change to fix it? Did you get
the teeth undercut in the process? Were any of your selector forks
bent?

I've probably missed all this on earlier threads.

Cheers Bone.

Hi Bone,
she was lurching at the hiugher rev rate - around 6 to 7,000 rpm and up she would suddenly lurch out of gear and back into gear. The first time she did it I lost traction on the back tyre and left a nice black squiggle on the tar - scared the shit out of me. Then it did it again. I had an '84 FJ1100 that did the same thing but was covered by warranty, so I knew what was happening.
Goingeasily through the gear and nothing would happen, so it was only when I was getting towards maximum horsepower through the gearbox that had her doing it.

I took the clusters down to my local bike shop and had them tell me what to replace - the pictured cogs and selector fork. As you can see from the poicture, the selector fork was munted well and truly.
Pete has suggested also putting heavier quality guide rods for the selector forks, if I have to do this again I'll be using his suggestion.


Max thanks for the info!!

Was wondering if it was related to the bent shifter fork probs that
made gear selection difficult..obviously not...but the info/pics in your thread seem to show that for major g/box work the cylinder block removal and crankcase spilt don't have to be done..thank you for that.

Cheers Bone!

They certainly don't mate, that's what made it a reasonably straight forward job. Don't forget the good Torque Wrenches. They pay for themselves in bolts not stripped or broken.

Regards.


Max

[Mike 55]

Off to order a genuine Snoozuki Workshop Manual.... May have to wear a balaclava to the bank though..Apparently you need to bring 2 wallets.. As for the torque wrenches I am Snap On equipped for those..And as Pete says common sense will help a lot. Now where do I get some of that ?? Thanks for the advice guys, and Pete it is a '99 model with 157k on the clock,but the seal was not leaking until I tried to remove it from without.... Read the manual and then read some more before attempting the job !! From now on anyhow..

[fasterfaster]

Mark ............. it's that old saying if all else fails read the manual lol Also just download manual in PDF format and then you can print of pages as you want ? If not for free you can buy them online for under $10
Greeny thats Gazza the welder .................. pretty neat job hey ? He also jigs them while he welds them as it's imperative that they are welded central.

[Madmax]

Mark ............. it's that old saying if all else fails read the manual lol Also just download manual in PDF format and then you can print of pages as you want ? If not for free you can buy them online for under $10
Greeny thats Gazza the welder .................. pretty neat job hey ? He also jigs them while he welds them as it's imperative that they are welded central.

You know where, in the manual it says "Always use new circlips!"

I ordered the new circlips before did the last rebuild only to have Suzuki advise they had a computer failure and couldn't get the new circlips to my until the Monday I was to be riding the bike to and from work, so I used the old circlips.

The bad news is that while dicing down Brown Mountian on the way to Tathra and the Busa bash, I realised I couldn't select 1st gear at all! That'll f*** it! Pete pretty well confirms what I considered was the problem, One of the old circlips I used has grown under the pretty harsh riding conditions (redline shit) and has lifted out of its rebate in the shaft, allowing the dogs the separate sufficently so as to not be anywhere near each other when I go for 1st. I've got the motor out on the bench after a days work with most of the periferals off the motor.

The good news is that I did this same job this year already so I have an idea of what's coming. I have the new circlips, gaskets et al and have embarked on the job. Have been waiting for 2 weeks for billet selector shafts to come from Schnitz racing. They are being slow to deliver so I'm now on tentahooks waiting to see if they get here before I put the motor back together. I have a few days to spare so hopefully they'll get here Wed or Thursday.

Don't you just hate having to scrape old gaskets off the mating surfaces!! Worst part of the job.

Later.


Max

[Madmax]

You know where, in the manual it says "Always use new circlips!"

I got the clusters out this arvo. The pictures tell the story. The circlip between the 1st driven gear and the cog that drives it had a circlip twisted into a mess that was stopping the driving gear engaging it at all.
The result will be a new shaft, driven gear and a few other bitsand pieces to make a new cluster up.



After hammering the driven cog off the shaft.


This is going to cost a few $bob.

The violent twisting action has actually pushed the locating button located in the rebate down through the casting of the case, without exiting the case at all happily otherwise I'd be looking for new crankcases, still looking for a save in there somewhere. Gotta find a way to get the button back up to locate the driveshaft bearing.







Tells you something about the stresses we have in these engines okay.



Max

[fasterfaster]

Max the picture indeed does tell the story as looking at the mark across the top of the locator pin I'd say it hasn't been aligned with the bearing on assembly and when cases have been tightened it's pushed it thru the casting. Rotational force would tend to tear the casing with the pin not drive it downward. The pin also not locating the bearing would allow excess sideways movement of the gear and hence the result as the bearing has moved outward resulting in excess play which has then allowed the gear to hammer at the circlip. You could probably use a pin punch to tap the pin back out Max and then it looks like there is enough room to carefully fine drill casing boss underneath the locator and put a small roll pin in underneath to prevent it being able to move down out of place. Should be a few good second hand shafts kicking around at the right price ?

[Maj]

Yeah i have a good drive shaft , replaced it with a hd shaft on my racebike ,

use the bearing oil hole and a pic or fine tipped screwdriver to rotate and move the bearing to get it engaged properly on assembly, your lucky last one i know of that missed getting it right cracked the cases

you could drive it back out and get a spot of ali weld inthe damaged area to retain it, or relocate the pin further around and drill a new hole
but measure carefully the position as this sets the clearances , as your cooked shim shows

[Madmax]

Max the picture indeed does tell the story as looking at the mark across the top of the locator pin I'd say it hasn't been aligned with the bearing on assembly and when cases have been tightened it's pushed it thru the casting. Rotational force would tend to tear the casing with the pin not drive it downward. The pin also not locating the bearing would allow excess sideways movement of the gear and hence the result as the bearing has moved outward resulting in excess play which has then allowed the gear to hammer at the circlip. You could probably use a pin punch to tap the pin back out Max and then it looks like there is enough room to carefully fine drill casing boss underneath the locator and put a small roll pin in underneath to prevent it being able to move down out of place. Should be a few good second hand shafts kicking around at the right price ?

Sounds like you're on the money Pete as much as I hate to admit it, yoiur logic sounds real.

Thanks for the offer Mag, where are you located? It may be worth a trip.

Glen has also offered his spare, just depends which of you guys is closer to Canberra



Cheers and thanks.

[fasterfaster]

It's called r n d Max .................... and I bet it never happens again
Maj is in Vic Max and also spot on re the excess preload when you look at the heat bluing (new word)

[Maj]

can post express tomorrow, swap you for your old gears;)

[Madmax]

can post express tomorrow, swap you for your old gears;)

I did a road trip to Sydney today. Glen happily had a spare shaft and gear set to get me out of strife. I'll use his shaft with my gears to get out of the shit and then replace his parts with newbies.

Thanks for the offer, it really is appreciated.

I'll see if I can tap the locating pin up and then insert said role pin or small bolt to hold it in place. This obviously calls for some more R&D Pete! lol I'm certainly paying my dues with this baby!


Max

---

A big thanks to Glen who gave me his spare output shaft to use so I can get the Black Beast on the road for work next week. Very generous of you Glen and very much appreciated. I'll replace the shaft and 1st driven gear with new ones when they come in.

Cheers and thanks again.



Max - of dubious gearbox repairing skills!