Fake Pazzo's

[amcmo]

Have seen some of the comments about low cost Pazzo copies.

We've been looking around the world for an alternative to Pazzo with similar quality and have come across disturbing information about most Asian copies (and one European).

Most cost copies appear to use a CAST lever that is then sandblasted before being finished with a cnc machine to look as though they were made from billet. Several factories swore back and blue it was billet, however testing shows otherwise. When pressed with the evidence, 1 admitted cnc FINISHED.

Had two claimed to be the factory where Pazzo were made, however have confirmed Pazzo are definitely Canada made.

Defnitely most inferior. Guess it doesn't matter if you're only after a cheap knock off with no concern for quality, however I'd rather the full cnc part.

[Rainbow7]

Interesting.

I had been wondering about that issue, as I doubted that the $40 eBay jobs were actually made of billet alloy.

Thanks for this info.

[CeeJay07]

Name & shame them.

[Tito]

At the end of the day, it all comes down to personal choice. Me, the last thing I would ever want, would be to come barreling into a 35 or 45 corner, with just a touch to much pace, and have my brake lever snap. I don't mind cutting costs in some areas at all, but not when it comes to brakes and tyres.

[Rainbow7]

I don't mind cutting costs in some areas at all, but not when it comes to brakes and tyres.

I totally agree.

[BikerBoy]

I do believe I said they were a cast alloy from the start.

Have you ever wondered what happens to all your empty beer cans?

[BLACKZOOK]

What exactly is the problem with cast alloy, you do realise that the largest party of your bike frame is made of cast alloy? Yes late braking and having the lever snap is bad but surely no worse than having the frame snap at the steering head or swing arm pivot.

Wouldnt it make more sence to check for actual failure stories on the net before you make your decision?

I dont have either lever fake or original pazo so have no vested interest here just find it hard to understand bagging any product withiout researching it first.

However I do have a problem with a company claiming its something its not. How about posting up proof of who is claiming their levers are cast so we can all avoid a dishonerable vendor.

[amcmo]

Cast alloy does have a different structure to billet. Then, there is also a difference in cast, low pressure die cast and high pressure die cast.

One of the know issues with aluminium is that you can get voids in a casting if not careful. One of the biggest issues with the old English bikes - porous castings that allowed oil to seep through. Some of the Chinese pit bikes still suffer from lousy castings.

In normal use there should be no reason for a properly a cast lever to snap, however there have been cases of breakage in poorly cast products.

I do remember several years ago some metalurgist forecasting that aluminium bike frames would at some point in their lives begin to exhibit fatigue symptoms and I think it was motocross bikes he said could be expected to see frame breakages.

I'm checking with my solicitor on naming and shaming. I know the truth is a defence, but I don't want to get tied up spending a fortune defending that position.

[Aussie Steve]

The original levers are cast so I figure if they snap then any casting will. There is a great difference in quality I agree so a cheap casting will be weaker. As for the fake pazzo's I am not so sure they are cast. The weight is too heavy for that. Billet alluminium is forged from an original casting thus is more dense and heavy. I guess the only sure way of knowing is to break one of the cheap ones and check. Cast will have a very crystaline porous structure as apposed to billet which has a very dense one. Anyhoo I got the shorties just to be safe!

[big kev]

What exactly is the problem with cast alloy, you do realise that the largest party of your bike frame is made of cast alloy? Yes late braking and having the lever snap is bad but surely no worse than having the frame snap at the steering head or swing arm pivot.

Wouldnt it make more sence to check for actual failure stories on the net before you make your decision?

I dont have either lever fake or original pazo so have no vested interest here just find it hard to understand bagging any product withiout researching it first.

However I do have a problem with a company claiming its something its not. How about posting up proof of who is claiming their levers are cast so we can all avoid a dishonerable vendor.

+1 good call bruce

[Rainbow7]

What exactly is the problem with cast alloy, you do realise that the largest party of your bike frame is made of cast alloy?

I think it's more a question of the quality of the cast alloy, Zook. - I wouldn't trust my life to a Chinese-made alloy, whereas I feel confident that a Japanese motorcycle frame is a high quality casting.

[Aussie Steve]

British motorcycles leaked oil due to the case mating surfaces being of insuficient width and having a verticle split on all cases. They also had exterior oil lines which were prone to leakage and dry sumps which required an exterior oil tank. This was also compounded by having case mating surfaces that were not always perfect...don't forget all British bikes used to be made by hand....like Harleys are still done today.hehehehe!!!

[amcmo]

British motorcycles leaked oil due to the case mating surfaces being of insuficient width and having a verticle split on all cases. They also had exterior oil lines which were prone to leakage and dry sumps which required an exterior oil tank. This was also compounded by having case mating surfaces that were not always perfect...don't forget all British bikes used to be made by hand....like Harleys are still done today.hehehehe!!!

I agree to a certain extent, however there were several well publicised instances of the porous castings.

Believe me I know, having had BSA 650, Bonneville 750 (Porous), Commando 850 (porous), T160 Trident and rebuilt all but the T160 to eliminate oil leaks.

T160 was oil tight from day one until sold and that had an extra seam with 3 piece vertical casings.

BSA, bought 6 months old with run con rod bearings and crank timing side plain bearing due to dry sump line blow off. The vertical seam while challenging, with correct assembly can be oil tight. The Porous castings were fixed by bead blasting which also helps the vertical surfaces.

Properly assembled the dry sump tank and lines are no problem. Several Japanese models have had them. (CB750 1975 dry sump, not a drop of oil, but not great handling, though a dream compared to my Kwaka 750 triple - still have the scars).

On the Pazzo Copies I am NOT saying that all copies are cast - I've only sampled a few and there are dozens out there. Just a cautionary tale that all is not always as claimed.

Just about forgot, one factory in pictures of their manufacturing process showed waht appears to be an extrusion several metres long in lever shape which they cut then machine.

[big kev]

i would ask you show some relevence to your post here mate , so what if these cheep asian pazzo's are poor castings , thats totally up to the person , im pretty sure that most or all of bike riders know whats crap and whats not , so whats the relevence with this thread , i have a set of pazzo long , a set of CRG and im looking at another lot that fold up , it there shit and they break then i wont buy them again im sure most riders work on the same system lol

its the same with just about anything to do with motorcycleing if its shit or the supplier or the shop is shit then usually no 1 touches them and they cop a hideing on forums , and they usually go broke

[Rainbow7]

Kev, I think he's just giving us a sort of "consumer warning". I know I'd appreciate being warned about something like this. - I wouldn't want to be the guy who discovered the hard way that something I'd bought was a piece of crap. (I wonder if the cheap ones pass ADR, too. - Could be an insurance issue.)

You're right, in that bad products generally won't stay on the market for long, but I also think we have a responsibility to our fellow riders to warn them about things like this.

I'm glad AMC posted this.