Lies lies lies
#1
The general public belive any bullshit coppers and the goverment dole out hand over fist
its about time someone came out and spoke the truth
.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/sto...public_rss

IT took just five hours for the first road carnage newspaper headline to appear at the start of the 2007 Christmas-New Year holiday period.


South Australian police operating a random breath testing station. Picture: Brenton Edwards

A man was killed when a stolen car crashed at an intersection during a chase in Melbourne at 5am on December 20.

And so it began: the parade of news presenters, police using words such as slaughter and issuing pleas to slow down, and graphic images of mangled wreckage, sobbing relatives and friends, and flowers laid at crash sites.

Properly analysed, road death toll figures demonstrate there is an extraordinary lack of debate about the real reasons behind fatalities and injuries in crashes. An examination of the figures shows that with all the speed and red light cameras, anti-alcohol measures, vehicle safety, improvements, road upgrades, street lighting and big spending on creative advertising over the past five years, the death toll has largely plateaued. Over that period total national vehicle registrations (adjusted for deregistered vehicles) have risen from 13.162 million (10.365 million of them passenger vehicles) to just over 14.8 million (11.51 million passenger vehicles). During 2007, an average of 9200 new (and safer) vehicles came on to the roads every month.

Data shows Australia has been very good at reducing road trauma. The death ratio per 100,000 population has been about the same for the past five years. Injury totals have declined significantly because of vehicle impact performance, faster paramedic response and more effective medical intervention. As a result, holiday road trauma does not justify the alarmist treatment it gets or the authorities' shock-horror rhetoric.

Figures from the federal Australian Transport Safety Bureau show that for several years state authorities have set the Christmas-New Year holiday period at 13 days (in Victoria in 2007 it began at midnight on December 20 and ended at midnight on January4). In 2006, the last full year for which ATSB figures are available, 62 people died: drivers, passengers, motorcyclists, cyclists and pedestrians. That represented an average of 4.7deaths a day. The same figures show that for the entire year, deaths averaged 4.38 a day and the most lethal weekly period year-long is Friday to Sunday, when there is an average of 5.4 deaths a day. For the five days of Easter 2007, there were an average of five deaths a day.

It shows during holiday periods roads are no more dangerous than on the average weekday, and certainly safer than during normal weekends. And this is despite the diluting holiday logistics of extra distances covered, heavier traffic, bigger passenger loads, unroadworthy vehicles, drivers not used to distance driving, greater stress, more distractions and increased alcohol consumption.

Of 1000 drivers stopped for random breath-testing, two or less per 1000 tested positive (over .05) and 65 per cent of those tested between .05 and .08, according to Australia's data bank of driver blood-alcohol content, now the longest-running and most detail-rich in the world. A three-week blitz by Victorian police in the first three weeks of December2007, yielded 989 positives out of 192,000 tests: a little less than 2per cent.

All ordinary fatal crashes (can there be such a thing?) are attended by local police, not an elite crash investigation unit. So the death of a lone driver on a straight country road against a tree, in the absence of any obvious evidence of alcohol, drugs, another vehicle or braking marks, leads police to tick the box marked speed. Never mind that it could be caused by 30,000km-old windscreen wiper blades crazing the windscreen, bald tyres, scored brake discs, no seatbelts or even a huntsman spider falling into the driver's lap from a sun visor.

Excessive speed is a simple reason commonly cited to explain a very complex problem. There is no single reason for a crash. Every crash is the result of a series of tumblers falling in the wrong sequence. Multiple-death crashes are extremely rare occurrences. However, no official will admit that factors such as vehicle roadworthiness, road engineering or maintenance, weather, or even untimely text messaging could be significant factors.

US National Health and Traffic Safety Administration researchers produced a survey of fatal crash data that found excessive speed to be a small or negligible factor. It blamed driver inattention, "failure to see", and loss of control as by far the commonest causes.

When 50 people died in the 1997-98 Victorian Christmas-New Year holiday period (which began that year on December 18), the government convened an immediate road safety summit. After meeting for one hour, the participants announced an extension of the zero blood-alcohol limit to the first three years of a licence and the suspension of the licence of any driver exceeding a speed limit by 20km/h. Their perspicacity was reinforced by a senior police officer, who used the much-run television footage of a red Falcon wagon that had been parked that holiday under a Hume Highway overpass and whose four sleeping occupants had been decapitated by a semitrailer, to demand compulsory five-hour rest stops for drivers and, further, the mandatory use of crash helmets for all passengers.

About the same time the NSW Stay Safe Committee recommended that as most deaths happened on two-lane country roads, all overtaking on such roads should be banned in the state. Common sense prevailed in that case. In November 2004, Victorian premier Steve Bracks called for car speedometers to be capped at 130km/h. The motor industry considered it the stupidest idea ever suggested.

In 2002, Victoria followed New Zealand and Britain and painted a number of police road patrol cars in garish colour schemes. Police responded by hiding them in scrub and behind buildings to set up speed traps. (I watched a thick scrub set-up on the Princes Highway book almost 100 bike riders in 90 minutes as they returned north from the Australian Grand Prix on Phillip Island).

And so the road safety lie has been embedded, preying on road users' perceptions that if they don't drink and drive, or exceed the speed limit, they will be safe from the depredations of crazed drivers.

It reinforces the common feeling that if an act is made illegal, it will fix things. However, people will always ignore what they perceive as bad or unenforceable laws: tailgating, failure to keep left, the use of mobile phones and (in some states) the suspension of dangly objects from the rear vision mirror.

Several surveys have confirmed more than 30 per cent of drivers continue to drive while disqualified. Speed cameras can't stop that.

Yet, even as state governments project traffic infringement revenue into annual budgets, they continue to insist that fixed and mobile cameras - euphemistically called safety cameras - are located in black-spot zones and not used for revenue raising.

In 2005, NSW, which posts signs warning of fixed speed cameras, issued about 550,000 traffic infringement notices. Victoria - with fewer drivers, far less road surface mileage, and no such signposting - sent out 1.07 million; 82 per cent of those were for speeds less than 15km/h over the limit. Apart from a relative handful of cameras policing 40km/h school speed zones, the vast majority are placed on roads with high traffic volumes.

In May 2005, the South Australian Government announced it would spend $35.6 million of its road safety budget of $60 million on 50 new red light intersection cameras, adding to the 12 existing cameras that in their first year of operation in 2004 generated $11 million in revenue. Yet the Government's official figures showed that over the previous eight years, disobeying traffic lights had caused only 1.34per cent of fatal crashes.

Victoria Police runs almost 300 fixed speed and red light cameras, estimating that about three million vehicles are tabbed every month. Yet so far Victoria Police and its enforcement partners, VicRoads and the Traffic Accident Commission, have refused to reveal any detail of the infringements from the new average speed traps set on both three-lane sides of the Hume Highway early in 2007. These set-ups measure average speeds up to 72km/h into and out of Melbourne, issuing fines for speeds averaging more than 3km/h over the limit over distances as short as 3km. There are no notices warning hapless interstate drivers.

Emphasis in all Australian states has shifted from surveillance and visual deterrence to speed measurement, as if this is the main crash factor apart from alcohol.

The overemphasis on speed as a factor justifies government investment in ever more sophisticated technology to trap more vehicle users; in fact, government polling shows this gives voters a nice warm feeling because the authorities are seen to be doing something. Thus, as mobile road patrols vanish, we are losing the ability to check on the use of phones, suspended licences, outstanding warrants, underage drivers, the wearing of seat restraints, lane discipline, tailgating, unroadworthy vehicles and the rest.

No longer do police sit and watch for those rolling through stop signs, as they did in the 1970s, nor can they lurk at railway level crossings to stop the growing incidence of vehicle-train crashes. They can't. They simply don't have the manpower, or are diverted to more revenue-worthy pursuits.

There are calls for more transparency and more rational debate on new ways to lower road trauma, apart from the standard techniques of more disinformation to justify more technology and greater punishment.

The all-states Australian Transport Council created by the Howard government in 2000 as part of a road safety strategy set a target to cut road deaths by 40 per cent by 2010.

On New Year's Eve, Australian Automobile Association chief executive Mike Harris told The Australian: "Unless something serious is done, we've got no chance of reaching that 2010 target. In terms of the national road safety strategy target, we're actually going backwards when you look at the statistics."

And, based on the statistics, that "something serious" could well be understanding that the huge emphasis on speeding and drink driving may even be counterproductive. Anecdotal evidence suggests that 95 per cent of people don't exceed speed limits and even fewer drink and drive. So their belief is that if they avoid those offences, they don't have to pay much more attention to being safe or driving carefully.

Bill Tuckey is the former motoring editor of BRW and former editor of Wheels magazine
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#2
I read that today and agreed totally. Put a BIG tick on it.
Regards,

Busdriver (aka Les)
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#3
also heard lately plans to introduce GPS speed limiters.
[Image: SigPic100.jpg] Copper/Silver - The original, the rest are just copies.
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#4
Volvi Wrote:also heard lately plans to introduce GPS speed limiters.
Saw that too Volvi, the Poms reckon it will only be aimed at repetitive speeders, GPS package that scans your passage through various speed zones and gives you a warning beep if you are exceeding the limit, then advises Police of your braking the speed limit then slows your vehicle down to a slowers speed, these are the three stages available to the operators. Scary shit when they can control the speed of your vehicle from space.


MaxAustralia2HayabusaAustralia2
Good weather, good woman, good road, good bike, good-bye!!
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#5
I can't find the original source, but here's my memory of a story I found in Two Wheels about the evidence against speed camera's in the UK. It was from a couple of years ago.

It went something like this....

The traffic authority was berating a county for not allowing speed cameras to be installed within it's boundaries. The county claimed that there had never been a road fatality in the area and it wasn't justified. Part of the M25 went through that county - a road that carries 50,000 vehicles every day. That county shared borders with 5 other counties. One already had camera's and the remaining 4 decided to allow camera's to be installed.

End result?

ALL 5 surrounding counties experienced an INCREASE in road fatalities - starting within days of the camera's being installed. The county that did not allow the camera's to be installed still has not experienced even one fatality. Not one.

I'm not saying that speed camera's are always bad - in a true black spot with clear warnings they would save lives. Drivers would slow down because they see the warning - or suffer the consequences. Trouble is, our camera's are positioned for revenue, not road safety.

Now, most people would say... "Well, move them or get rid of them!" but the hitch is.... our state governments RELY on that revenue. They've become (in a way) addicted to the steady stream of income. They won't increase direct charges and taxes because that hurts them on polling day - so they tax us indirectly. I don't think I could exist in Victoria. I'd lose my license within weeks. At least here in NSW the fixed camera's (including red light ones) have warning signs. But they still aren't positioned in black spots in the vast majority of cases.

So the state governments can't afford to get rid of the camera's and as their need for revenue increases I fear the "legal" bar will be lowered until we can barely get around.

What is the solution? I can honestly say I don't have a clue. Far better minds than mine have tried and failed.

The other thing is bike commuters. They are popping up everywhere. Peak hour is a disaster because of all the slow peddlers. You can't get around them... and even if you do at the next traffic light they just trickle up to the front, position themselves in front of the first vehicle and.... its too frustrating for words!

I'm depressed... I'm stopping now.
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#6
I wonder how much more can we be squeezed and pushed every wich way till someone explodes like a port arthur, some people just cant take it like some others and the Gov. always says Well u dont have to worry if u a law abiding person. Well a law abiding person 25yrs ago would be doing at least 2- 10yrs in the nick in todays times and laws,that shows u how much we have been cooked in the warm water over time. i have no answere but another world war might do the trick.AT a wild guess U would know who would be the first to get it....... Whenpigsfly
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#7
cops and their puppetiers are lazy and seek the biggest financial gain for the least expense,the road safety line is beyond a tired joke.Stop doing the things they can easily measure in the easy spots for them to measure,guard yourself against them,have a code of conduct on spirited group rides and life looks a little better. alot of older guys on sportsbikes do their homework before they do their rides to minimise their exposure to the lazy revenue raiser.Road tolls will never drop when their intentions aren,t for road safety.
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#8
Lies, Lies, Lies = $$$ Pi_freak
never fly higher than your angel.
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#9
they day they tell m there putting a gps speed limiter on my bike is the day i either start a riot or move to another country
Regards

Dan
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#10
Yes i'm so bloody fed up with all this rubbish! Pi_freak How many more ridiculous laws, restrictions, preventative measures are they going to impose.

What scares me is the thought of how controlled everything will be in 20-30 years time. Surely there is a point where the line needs to be drawn. It seriously reminds me of both Brave New World & 1984.

We sadly seem to be moving in that general direction.

I don't even enjoy long rides on the highway much anymore particularly my ride home over the christmas break.

Reason being because I had to spend more time checking my speedo than I did concentrating on the ride. Its ridiculous, With double demerits, I'm peering down there every 5 bloody seconds just incase I come over the hill and a boy in blue is merrily waiting for me. This alone I think is more dangerous than speeding, having to use so much effort to maintain a steady 110kph or whatever its a joke.

All I can say is I came back after double demerits & the trip was suitably faster, less tiring & certainly much more enjoyable. Our bikes like steady speeds of 160-180 on the highway, thats more like cruising speed for these babies.

I know it would never happen, but trucks, cars & motorcycles should all have separate speed limits based on their potential ability to kill/maim other road users.

A truck at 110km/hr would probably cause 10 times the damage a motorcycle would at the same speed. So maybe trucks @ 110, Cars @ 140-150 & bikes @ 180 or thereabouts. Yep i'm dreaming.....

And then ofcourse you have the fact that some cars/bikes just can't safely do those speeds without almost falling apart. A little economy car will struggle to do 140 & will be all over the shop at that speed whereas a well developed sports car will be just warming up. Same with someone trying to do 150 on a postie bike....its simply not designed to do it.

Not sure what the solutions are, but hopefully there is a huge backlash before it all gets too out of hand
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#11
Great thread! Agree with it all. Such a shame that pollies are trapped in the revenue bind now and that's exactly the root cause. Polling day and taxes. Sure thing!
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#12
ClapGuys,
You lot should be running the country, Staysafe, the NRMA and any other body that embraces road safety. All good reasoned arguments and well researched data with reasonable conclusions. You'll never see that from a pollie or the sycophantic public servants like that twat Eric Rootingdal (NSW Roads Minister what a complete clown!!!) I was actually starting to get paranoid because when I made the same sorts of noises on the SV forum a couple of the people on the forum got very Al Queda and basically wrote me off as a speed hoon (I'm pretty sure these jerks are just plod). FFS!!! I am a 47 YO father of 3 boys who all love bikes and I have no doubt will follow me in both riding/racing for pleasure as well as on the road. I need to set the example here. But there is no way I will tell them to ride slowly stay in the traffic, follow the sheep. I don't do it in either car or bike. Stay away from the pack. Ensure you maintain as much visibility as possible, stay out of blind spots etc etc. You lot all know the drill as well. Yet inspite of riding fairly conservatively I am about to take another enforced break while the incompetent fuckwits are left on the road The other fuckwits around us don't seem to consider that we are the ones who get badly hurt in any sort of accident. I have been riding for 31 years now and managed to avoid an accident until early last year when a bloke going into a private driveway turned across the front of me as I went through a green light. The police report from that farce was rediculous. My wife was at the lights directly behind me when the accident happened yet would not take a statement from her!!! Absolutely scandalous.. You'll also see all these jokers from govt and plod trying to take credit for a reduction in the no. of deaths each year over the last 20 years or so. Yet the no of accidents occuring each year continue to rise and particular types of accidents (like head on for example) continue top rise. This doesn't make any allowance for the unreported nose to tail accidents on busy , wet roads. They forget to facttor in the amazing improvements in vehicle safety due to technology and material developments etc. There a pack of lying cheating misleading useless C*&ts. Another area where I think particularly NSW has suffered in the last 20 years or so is pavement condition. Riding along roads like King George's Road Heathcote Road Woodville Road etc etc in Sydney now is an absolute nightmare. Grease and oil, potholes deep enough to lose the Titanic in, unclear or misleading lane markings. It's an absolute joke. And I am absolutely convinced that Police methodology causes a lot of the accidents that happen. Some people are too scared to plant it when overtaking, while it's completely normal for some wankers to sit in the middle lane and block the road just because they're doing the speed limit. Every second driver has Mobile phone disease (and their skills are left wanting without trying to talk at the same time!!!) Proper driver education (IE Germany has a good model) and being prepared to accept that some people shouldn't be allowed to drive a motor vehicle.
I personally believe that everyone should have to do 6 months on a bike before they can drive a car and everyone should have to learn in and do their driving test in a manual.. Well there's my vent for the day...I am putting away the soap box ...Just one more thing for Rootendal and his PLod matesShowback
Good thread guys
It's a week by week charade.
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#13
Ok boys looks like some civil disobediance is in order im happy to get tossed in the clink for standing u for basic human freedm so lets start burning some fixed cameras down, hijacking the vans or 4wds the put speed camers in. lets start telling the coppers to get f****d for giving us a ticket for 65 in a 60 zone
Regards

Dan
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#14
but please not im not advocating violence against anyone!
Regards

Dan
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#15
totally agree with you.

Its interesting to see what has happened in the NT. The last place in Australia that had an open speed limit has now had a 130km/hr speed limit imposed. With the speed limit in place, the road toll has already been 25% higher than the year before when the limit did not exist. Some very good reasons why: (I have condensed some info from a site here)

Fatigue crashes are vastly increased – people will still try to do ‘big kilometres†per day and may need to cover these distances. There will be many more crashes at night – as more will have to drive into the night to reach destinations.

Driving at night is a lot more dangerous than during the day. Driving at night requires much more concentration as there is reduced visibility and the possibility of large animals being on the road. A driver who is fatigued is more susceptible to having an accident with another vehicle or an animal. This means that fatigued drivers present a danger to other drivers and themselves.



Set a limit and people will drive to it – no matter what the conditions. If the limit is 130, people will try to do 130. With no limit, people will read the conditions and the capability of their vehicle, and drive to those conditions. Therefore, speed limits should not be set unless the upper limit is OK for the whole stretch – If the limit is 110km/h, people do try to sit on 110 without thinking – no matter what the conditions. Where the limit is open, people will drive to what they can do – safely.



Increase difficulty in overtaking dangerous traffic build-up.

We all know how annoying this is. Getting stuck behind a truck & looking for an opportunity to pass. On my bike, I absolutely flaw it pass anything, there is far less danger of the vehicle coming into my lane, & the acceleration of my vehicle gets me away from potential danger faster. But with a speed limit we need to hold a constant steady speed going past massive trucks that most likely cannot see you! craziness!



Increased traffic congestion behind road trains and trucks as vehicles will bank up, increasing frustration, fatigue and the likelihood and severity of accidents. This also results in longer traveling times caused by delays and congestion when stuck behind trucks.


Road rage will no doubt increase due to fatigue, frustration and longer traveling times caused by passing trucks and other slower moving vehicles.

Another point is that federal legislation allows vehicle manufacturers in Australia to have a 10% variance in the speedometer.

Many people will, and do in other States & Territories, get speeding penalties when they believe they are obeying the law.

If you have already been fined for speeds of 142km/h in a 130 km/h zone, then this is already below the 10% error permitted in your motor vehicle speedometer calibration!

Also, your speedometer will vary as your tyres wear? Effectively your rolling diameter will change as your tyres wear or if you alter the size of your tyres.

There are too many inconsistencies across the board in my opinion.

A look at the effect of speed camera's other enforcement shows how ineffective they really are http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/01/136.asp

Arrr, thats enough reading for the moment Very Happy
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