BlueCenturion Penalty levels - when does it become Reckless?

[Slong]

We all know the common penalties, up to +45 over speed limit [or is that +40?] = 12 months + ~$420, but at what point will we be charged with something more than that, or get a summons to court? Assuming that 'all' we were doing was speeding on a quiet road?
[No, I'm not busted again, I'm still doing my time - I just want to know.]

Cheers,
-jon-

[ac boosa]

Not wanting to chop in on bluecenturion but..

It comes down to the environmental factors and, of course, that lovely thing called 'officer discretion'. For example, I had a fellow come in last week charged with speeding simplicita - just plain speeding for doing 179km/h which was along a highway at 2 in the morning. Alternatively I had another young lad a few weeks ago who did a runner and reached speeds of about 150 - 160 but because of the added 'danger' got pinched for dangerous driving. That being said, speed alone can constitute dangerous or reckless driving (even though I could put up a credible argument that doing 250 on a Busa along a 4 lane h-way a 2 in the morning isnt 'dangerous' at all), but a jury didnt buy a similar argument a few years ago up here in 'vegas when a champ got done for 240 on his ZZR1100 along a motorway - just escaped being sent to jail.

cheers
adrian

[bigshowbusa]

'as above'...
generally, rule of thumb (VIC) is double the posted limit, but that is not set in stone...

[bluecenturion]

^^^^^^ What they said...the two formal charges here in Vic are Manner dangerous and Speed dangerous, it has to have regard to all the circumstances of the particular incident...at least here in Vic a very high speed on it's own may not constitute a danger (the 3 AM freeway jaunt, but doing the same at 4 PM would..etc...) common sense is usually applied to each incident on its own merits. Truth be told most coppers are lazy..if we can get away with only writing a ticket, (and fully detail to the offending motorist what may occur if they challenge the ticket in court) then that's what we'll do. To the last I will grapple with thee; from Hell's heart I stab at thee; for Hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee.

[kamakazebusa]

I got a court summons after a RBT unit pulled me up on the way to picking my girlfriend up from the station.
I was already disqualified for 12 months, they didn't say anything except "see you in court". No fine, no ticket ,nothing....all I got was a little piece of paper with a court appearance date on it.....

Which brings me to my next question for BlueCenturion (I think we should make up your own personal post BC)....

I was give a ticket about 3 weeks ago for speeding 15+ ( 3 points and about $197 , except it was double demerit w'end) which ended up being 6 points off my licence, now i'm left with 6.
The question is : they didn't pull me over straight away, and the fact that they were on-coming in the opposite direction with a median strip between us, can a radar detect your speed on the other side of the road (with 3 lanes between u) and why didn't they put there lights on and do a u-turn straight away. I had already traveled 2 klm's before they pulled me up. Asked if i had an exuse for speeding I said "I wasn't aware I was speeding" It was at 11.30pm just outside eastern creek raceway, there were no other cars or trafic on the road. I got done at 80 in a 60 zone.
What I would like to know ( I'd like your opinion too ac boosa) if i take this matter to court, do i have a chance, and if so can I reduce my points.

One thing i must tell you is that my driving history is not very good.....

[bluecenturion]

Sounds like you're from NSW bloke..but they use the same radar system as our highway guys...In a word yes you can get done from oncoming by what's called a moving mode radar...I'm guessing it took a while to catch you because the coppers prolly had to slow down, find a break in the median strip, do a u-turn, maybe having to give way or something..then speed up to catch you again..could take a minute or two..there's your 2 kays. You could take it to court, but you may only get off lighter if you pleaded guilty..you say you the only vehicle on the road at the time, that will be in the police evidence too, thereby negating the defence that the radar picked up another vehicle. By saying you weren't aware you were speeding is basically telling the court you weren't paying attention to what you were doing, another point against you. If you plead not guilty and win..then the whole matter will be dismissed with no points. If you plead not guilty and lose..you'll be up for costs, the courts and your barrister's, the magistrate will take a very dim view of the matter cos you will have wasted the court's time when you knew you were done dead-to-rights (in the court's opinon, that is) so the penalty will probably be harsher, then they'll take your driving/riding history into account...without going into it deeper, you might be looking at a gaol sentence...even if it's a community-based order, and that follows you around forever, and will come up in any security check done for employment purposes.

Now after all that..remember I'm Victoria based and I AM NOT the fount of all police/legal knowledge. Get some independent legal advice. Cheers To the last I will grapple with thee; from Hell's heart I stab at thee; for Hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee.

[kev11e]

G'day,
There are no doubt more learned people out there, but from my experience (in NSW) I would say cop it on the chin and do not go to court.
Some years ago I was reduced to the 12 month probationary licence, thought I stood a chance of a successful challenge in Court for various reasons (and still consider I had a worthwhile circumstance and case to plead), wasted a day worth of income, was reduced to an ineffective ignorant bubble by an aggressive magistrate (what happened to independence and lack of bias?), even to the point where the RTA solicitor (who is the enemy) asked me some questions to allow me to put myself in a better light, thought I was going to lose my licence altogether and get a bigger fine and maybe do time (the magistrate was THAT aggressive and adversarial) and at the end of the day I still had a probationary licence for 12 months. And less naivety :-)
To go to the trouble of booking you like that for only 20 kliks over...well I reckon they were hard up for a victim.
Kevin

[ac boosa]

^^^ what he said

I say what I tell 95% of speedsters that ring me for advice - it would be easier for me to defend you on a murder charge (touch wood ) than a speeding ticket. Speeding is a strict liability offence which effectively means you have to prove you're not guilty rather than vice versa. And to give you a bit of an idea, I've never done a speeding trial for less than $2500 and you can probably add a bit for a Sydney lawyers premium as well. Sorry dude

[kamakazebusa]

Well looks like I'm stuffed, I'll just cop it sweet I guess and try to ride sensible for a while. Thanks guys for your opinion, good to know I can get some professional advice from some fellow busa mates in the business......

Cheers lads....

[ac boosa]

ride sensible? on THAT bike?

[bluecenturion]

What he ^^^^^^ said... To the last I will grapple with thee; from Hell's heart I stab at thee; for Hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee.

[kamakazebusa]

I said try didn't I.....